[amsat-bb] Re: Fw: ELK or ARROW

[Jim Jerzycke]

Or you can just lengthen them 1/4" on a side with a threaded spacer....
Jim  KQ6EA


--- On Sat, 12/27/08, Gary "Joe" Mayfield <gary_mayfield at hotmail.com> wrote:

> From: Gary "Joe" Mayfield <gary_mayfield at hotmail.com>
> Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Fw:  ELK or ARROW
> To: amsat-bb at amsat.org
> Date: Saturday, December 27, 2008, 8:17 PM
> Has anyone played with insulating the Arrow elements from
> the boom?  It
> shouldn't be too hard to do.
> 
> 73,
> Joe kk0sd
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: amsat-bb-bounces at amsat.org
> [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces at amsat.org] On
> Behalf Of Jim Danehy
> Sent: Saturday, December 27, 2008 8:33 PM
> To: amsat-bb at amsat.org
> Subject: [amsat-bb] Fw: ELK or ARROW
> 
> 
>   there is the old adage that you get what you pay for . .
> . why buy a 
> poorly designed antenna that does not work very well
> > ?
> >
> > If you have a 5 element  yagi that only produces 4 dbi
> you are not getting
> 
> > what you paid for . . . most 2 element yagis would out
> perform that 
> > statistic . . . a 5 element yagi should be at least 9
> db + or 10 db dbd 
> > (dipole ) not isotropic  . . . . there is something
> that is called 
> > MERCHANTABILITY . . .i.e., an IMPLIED WARRANTY  that
> you are getting at 
> > least the minimum for your money . . .
> > 4 dbi for an Arrow is way off base . . .  so it is not
> just ; you can not 
> > afford a Cadillac but you are not even getting a Ford
> or Chevy  . .  i.e.,
> 
> > the gain of a 5 element yagi on 435 mhz . . .  that is
> the issue, not cost
> 
> > alone . . . . . . same comments apply to the ELK but I
> have attempted to 
> > make the point that there is a minimum performance for
> a certain number of
> 
> > elements that is pretty OBJECTIVE and when it is not
> met  . . . . well 
> > that is my point . . . these two antennas have shown
> to some testers that 
> > they do not measure up to the minimum EXPECTATIONS . .
> .unfortunately that
> 
> > is acceptable to some  . . . . then it becomes
> acceptable to many . . . 
> > and objectivity is abandoned . . .
> >
> > Jim W9VNE
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----- 
> > From: "Trey Brown"
> <palintheus at gmail.com>
> > To: "Jim Danehy"
> <jdanehy at cinci.rr.com>
> > Sent: Saturday, December 27, 2008 6:39 PM
> > Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] ELK or ARROW
> >
> >
> >> Thanks for the comments. Realize, though, that not
> everyone wants or
> >> can afford to have the Cadillac.
> >>
> >>
> >> On Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 4:06 PM, Jim Danehy
> <jdanehy at cinci.rr.com> wrote:
> >>> the Arrow antenna has been critiqued by Kent
> Britain, WA5VJB
> >>>
> >>>
> http://wa5vjb.com/references/Cheap%20Antennas-LEOs.pdf
> >>>
> >>> he says that some have measured the Arrow for
> gain on 435 mhz @ 4 dbi 
> >>> (isotropic) . . . . and that further analysis
> showed that for the 
> >>> element lengths used on 435 mhz that it peaks
> at 457 mhz and not 435 mhz
> 
> >>> . . . Kent is a well respected VHF/UHF antenna
> person who has plenty of 
> >>> credibility . . .
> >>>
> >>> Kent opines that the Arrow, as built does not
> have its elements 
> >>> insulated from the boom. It uses dimensions
> for insulated elements . . .
> 
> >>> so much for the Arrow . . . .
> >>>
> >>> Now for the ELK  : a local friend of mine owns
> an Arrow and he uses it 
> >>> successfully. He bought an ELK and attempted
> to compare the Arrow and 
> >>> the ELK . . . . he could not make an across
> town QSO on 435 mhz from his
> 
> >>> second story window with the ELK , so he sent
> the ELK back for a refund 
> >>> .
> >>>
> >>> I have worked and exchanged QSLs with several
> hundred satellite users . 
> >>> . .the majority of the folks that have worked
> and QSLed me (close to 250
> 
> >>> + ) have been using either the Arrow or ELK
> based upon the information 
> >>> on their cards. So they are popular. Are they
> optimum ? A lot of 
> >>> anecdotal information would seem to say NO . .
> .
> >>>
> >>> Thirty-five years ago I worked Oscar 6 with a
> homebrew 2 mtr yagi that 
> >>> probably was worse than either the Arrow or
> Elk but I worked YV and KL7 
> >>> from Indiana on CW with about 15 watts to the
> 3 elements which my XYL 
> >>> waved around at my directions . . . not any
> more . . .what do I use 
> >>> these days : a pair of circular polarity yagis
> on 10 foot booms 
> >>> manufactured by M Square . . . .
> >>>
> >>> Folks ask what should they buy ? Maybe a Ford
> or maybe a Chevy . . . 
> >>> neither is a Cadillac . . . .
> >>>
> >>> Jim W9VNE
> >>>
> _______________________________________________
> >>> Sent via AMSAT-BB at amsat.org. Opinions
> expressed are those of the author.
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> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> -- 
> >> Trey -- N5THX
> >>
> >> They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a
> little temporary
> >> safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.
> >> - Benjamin Franklin
> >>
> > 
> 
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