[amsat-bb] Thoughts on ISS packet switch back to 145.825 MHz (long)

Tue Apr 18 02:51:33 UTC 2017

Thanks Mike,

I appreciate your open, thoughtful and constructive discussion. Since you
don't even seem to have read the log, and the timestamp stations are
digipeating, I leave you to your beliefs.

I will stay to the facts and exit this discussion. :-) :-) :-)

73, Stefan VE4NSA

On Mon, Apr 17, 2017 at 8:22 PM, Mike Diehl <diehl.mike.a at gmail.com> wrote:

> Congrats Stefan, you still have no idea what ISS heard, only what it
> digipeated. Please also prove me wrong that a simplex channel can support
> more than 50% utilization. The fact only 5% of the pass had the ISS radio
> transmitting can either prove nothing or support the fact that there is so
> much QRM AT THE ISS that very few complete packets were heard and
> digipeated.
>
> As far as black listing goes the FCC has no authority over what data a
> site decides to exclude from showing. Sorry but you're reading and not
> comprehending what I stated.
>
> 73,
>
> Mike Diehl
> AI6GS
>
> On Apr 17, 2017, at 5:30 PM, Stefan Wagener <wageners at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Well Mike,
>
> Here is my log from the last pass. It shows 29 digipeats (~75% decoding
> success at my station) for 8+ minutes. Each packet is barely 1 1/2 seconds!
> That is a utilization of less then 5% assuming my math is correct.
>
> In addition, asking for "blacklisting of licensed operators" is something
> I certainly will not support and fortunately neither does the FCC.
>
> 73, Stefan, VE4NSA
>
>
> ..........................................
>
> Fm RS0ISS To CQ <UI pid=F0 Len=36 >[18:46:17] >ARISS - International
> Space Station
>
> Fm KE7ZXE-4 To CQ Via RS0ISS <UI pid=F0 Len=28 >[18:47:17]
>
> N7UWX DE KE7ZXE from CN86 me
>
> Fm VE6PW To U1PSWQ Via RS0ISS,ARISS <UI pid=F0 Len=32 >[18:47:59] `*Zvl
> _-/` Hello  via  ISS   _%
>
> Fm RS0ISS To CQ <UI pid=F0 Len=36 >[18:48:18] >ARISS - International
> Space Station
>
> Fm W8LR To S9SR2V Via RS0ISS <UI pid=F0 Len=47 >[18:49:51]`p0Kl p[/>CQ:
> Via ISS de W8LR Middletown Ohio=
>
> Fm W8LR To S9SR2V Via RS0ISS <UI pid=F0 Len=47 >[18:50:01]`p0Kl }[/>CQ:
> Via ISS de W8LR Middletown Ohio=
>
> Fm W8LR To S9SR2V Via RS0ISS <UI pid=F0 Len=47 >[18:50:11]`p0Kl j[/>CQ:
> Via ISS de W8LR Middletown Ohio=
>
> Fm KD0KZE To TUPX8Y Via RS0ISS <UI pid=F0 Len=49 >[18:50:17] `yaHl _-/
> Greetings via ISS from Circle Pines MN
>
> Fm RS0ISS To CQ <UI pid=F0 Len=36 >[18:50:18] >ARISS - International
> Space Station
>
> Fm W8LR To S9SR2V Via RS0ISS <UI pid=F0 Len=47 >[18:50:24] `p0Kl O[/>CQ:
> Via ISS de W8LR Middletown Ohio=
>
> Fm KD0KZE To TUPX8Y Via RS0ISS <UI pid=F0 Len=49 >[18:50:28] `yaHl _-/
> Greetings via ISS from Circle Pines MN
>
> Fm W8LR To APK003 Via RS0ISS <UI pid=F0 Len=40 >[18:50:35] :KD0KZE   :599
> Via ISS de W8LR Jerry{62
>
> Fm KD0KZE To TUPX8Y Via RS0ISS <UI pid=F0 Len=49 >[18:50:39] `yaHl _-/
> Greetings via ISS from Circle Pines MN
>
> Fm N7EKY-6 To T6PY2T Via RS0ISS,WIDE2-1 <UI pid=F0 Len=36 >[18:50:49]
> 'u&Bl _-/]CQ via ARISS,EN56jd,Paul=
>
> Fm W8LR To APK003 Via RS0ISS <UI pid=F0 Len=40 >[18:50:55] :KD0KZE   :599
> Via ISS de W8LR Jerry{62
>
> Fm W8LR To APK003 Via RS0ISS <UI pid=F0 Len=40 >[18:50:58] :N7EKY-6  :599
> Via ISS de W8LR Jerry{63
>
> Fm KD0KZE To TUPX8Y Via RS0ISS <UI pid=F0 Len=49 >[18:51:01] `yaHl _-/
> Greetings via ISS from Circle Pines MN
>
> Fm W8LR To S9SR2V Via RS0ISS <UI pid=F0 Len=47 >[18:51:11] `p0Kl w[/>CQ:
> Via ISS de W8LR Middletown Ohio=
>
> Fm W8LR To S9SR2V Via RS0ISS <UI pid=F0 Len=47 >[18:51:21] `p0Kl"F[/>CQ:
> Via ISS de W8LR Middletown Ohio=
>
> Fm W8LR To S9SR2U Via RS0ISS <UI pid=F0 Len=47 >[18:51:38] `p0Kl!%[/>CQ:
> Via ISS de W8LR Middletown Ohio=
>
> Fm KD0KZE To TUPX8Y Via RS0ISS <UI pid=F0 Len=49 >[18:52:07] `yaHl _-/
> Greetings via ISS from Circle Pines MN
>
> Fm W8LR To APK003 Via RS0ISS <UI pid=F0 Len=40 >[18:52:10] :KD0KZE   :599
> Via ISS de W8LR Jerry{62
>
> Fm W0BSH-3 To S8SW6R Via RS0ISS <UI pid=F0 Len=16 >[18:52:10] `v06l
> _>/]"5v}=
>
> Fm N7EKY-6 To T6PY2T Via RS0ISS,WIDE2-1 <UI pid=F0 Len=36 >[18:52:16]
> 'u&Bl _-/]CQ via ARISS,EN56jd,Paul=
>
> Fm W8LR To APK003 Via RS0ISS <UI pid=F0 Len=40 >[18:52:27] :N7EKY-6  :599
> Via ISS de W8LR Jerry{63
>
> Fm W8LR To APK003 Via RS0ISS <UI pid=F0 Len=40 >[18:52:30] :N7EKY-6  :599
> Via ISS de W8LR Jerry{64
>
> Fm W8LR To APK003 Via TS0ISS <UI pid=F0 Len=40 >[18:53:13] :N7EKY-6# :599
> Via QSS de W8LR Jerry{07
>
> Fm W8LR To APK003 Via RS0ISS <UI pid=F0 Len=40 >[18:53:15] :W0BSH-3  :599
> Via ISS de W8LR Jerry{65
>
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 17, 2017 at 4:51 PM, Mike Diehl <diehl.mike.a at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Greg,
>>
>> You make a good point about the complications of dropped packets. I have
>> some good recordings of voice stations getting a call back when as little
>> as a single letter of their call was heard. It's amazing how well we can
>> learn the voices of other ops when you're on regularly. This simply doesn't
>> happen on packet.
>>
>> Another complication is that it is on simplex. That means on a 10 minute
>> pass the maximum amount of time possible to digipeat is 5 minutes if the
>> channel is fully saturated. Subtract out the ISS beacons we end up with
>> less than 50% of the pass available for ISS to hear you.
>>
>> I'm not sure what the best solution is. You do bring up an interesting
>> point about APRS-IS. Maybe it's possible to have them black list fixed
>> beacon stations and remove the vanity aspect like you mentioned.
>>
>> 73,
>>
>> Mike Diehl
>> AI6GS
>>
>> > On Apr 17, 2017, at 1:26 PM, Greg D <ko6th.greg at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > Gabriel Zeifman wrote:
>> >> It's not complicated. However much it may be insisted ISS packet is not
>> >> SO-50, it is practically the same thing (single channel operating on
>> FM).
>> > Actually, the ISS digi is worse.
>> >
>> > With voice communication, one can sometimes pick up the start or tail of
>> > a call sign, as the astronaut demonstrated, and use that to filter a
>> > second try.  With digital, any bits that get corrupted result in no
>> > reception at all.
>> >
>> > I hate to suggest this, and admit I am assuming a cause without
>> > supporting evidence, but it might be necessary to remove the "vanity"
>> > aspect of ISS digipeating, and take down or hide from general view the
>> > reporting sites that support it.  While a useful tool for
>> > troubleshooting, I suspect the vanity aspect of seeing your call in a
>> > public list day after day from an unattended station may be too strong a
>> > draw for some, resulting in the clogged channel.  The SatGates that
>> > monitor for ISS and other APRS satellite traffic are still important
>> > part of the infrastructure, so that the information can be datamined
>> > from APRS-IS if you need it for troubleshooting.  But the consolidated
>> > lists of who has been seen digipeating through the ISS, I think, may be
>> > contributing more trouble than they are worth.
>> >
>> > Greg  KO6TH
>> >
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>> _______________________________________________
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>
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